Playbook Deep Dive

One thing Donald Trump loves to say is that he knows how to make a deal. And even for our allies, sometimes the “Art of the Deal” can feel like a shakedown. Ask NATO about that, and you’ll get some nods. But lately, Canada is the ally that’s been caught in Trump’s line of sight. The president-elect has been trolling Prime Minister Justin Trudeau on social media, calling him the “governor” of America’s “51st state,” and threatening to impose a 25 percent tariff on Canadian imports if they don’t step up their game on border security. On this episode of Playbook Deep Dive, Canada’s ambassador to the U.S., Kirsten Hillman, joins Playbook co-author Eugene Daniels to discuss how Justin Trudeau’s embattled government is rolling with Trump’s punches; enduring their own political crisis and making inroads with Trump world. Eugene Daniels is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO. Kirsten Hillman is the Canadian ambassador to the U.S. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Donald Trump’s Washington is going to be packed with heavyweights from big business such as Elon Musk, Scott Bessent and Howard Lutnick. But the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, which represents traditional business interests in D.C., has recently found itself estranged from its longtime allies in the Republican Party. On this episode of Playbook Deep Dive, the Chamber’s top lobbyist, former Rep. Rodney Davis, joins Playbook co-author Rachael Bade to discuss how the Chamber is winning back its swagger with the GOP and how they plan to interface with President-elect Trump. Rachael Bade is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO. Rodney Davis is the Head of Government Affairs at the U.S. Chamber of Commerce. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Generational change. It’s been a hot topic for Democrats ever since Joe Biden announced he’d run for a second term, and it's been picking up steam this past week as House Democrats pushed aside aging ranking members on key committees in order to make room for some younger leaders. In this episode, Playbook co-author Eugene Daniels speaks with Rep. Jared Huffman, who is challenging for the top Democratic slot on the House Natural Resources Committee, about what and who is behind this generational rebellion. Eugene Daniels is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO. Jared Huffman is the representative for California's 2nd district. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Sen. Kevin Cramer (R-N.D.) weighs in on President-elect Trump’s cabinet picks, the news of former Rep. Matt Gaetz’s withdrawal from attorney general consideration and his takes on some of the incoming president's most controversial ideas. Rachael Bade is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO. Kevin Cramer is the junior senator from North Dakota. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Sen. Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio) opens up for the first time about his recent defeat, and what he thinks his experiences holding a senate seat in reliably red Ohio since 2006 can teach fellow Democrats attempting to redefine the party’s brand. Eugene Daniels is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO. Sherrod Brown is the senior senator from Ohio. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Donald Trump is coming back to the White House. On this episode of Deep Dive, POLITICO’s top Trump-ologist, Meridith McGraw, and Playbook editor Mike DeBonis join host Rachael Bade to discuss how the next Trump presidency will defy our expectations. Included in this discussion: Who will be in Trump’s cabinet; who will lead the GOP on the Hill and can Trump really be sure that they’ll cooperate with him? On the Democratic side — how will they respond to their crushing defeat? And will they resist Trump’s every move as doggedly as they did during his first administration? Rachael Bade is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO. Meridith McGraw is a national political correspondent for POLITICO. Mike DeBonis is the editor of Playbook for POLITICO. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Top election forecasters Lakshya Jain (Split Ticket) and Logan Phillips (Race to the White House) join Playbook co-author Eugene Daniels to give their key insights and predictions for Tuesday. They discuss how to analyze early voting returns, who the remaining swing voters are, and why polls are more useful than most people give them credit for. Stay until the end, where they each share what one race that will be called early on Election Night that will signal to them who the next president is going to be. Eugene Daniels is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO. Lakshya Jain is CEO and co-founder of Split Ticket. Logan Phillips is founder of Race to the White House. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

James Carville is one of the oldest and best known political strategists in America. He also is the subject of a new CNN documentary called “Winning is Everything, Stupid.” On this episode of Deep Dive, Carville talks with host Ryan Lizza about his outlook on the election, including why he’s not so sure that it’ll be a close race once the votes are counted; what he thinks Kamala Harris could learn from Trump’s huckster style; and why Carville has absolutely no remorse for voicing his complaint that the Democratic Party’s culture was dominated by what he calls “preachy females.” Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO. James Carville is a Democratic political strategist. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Everyone knows the Latino vote will be decisive in this presidential election year. But our guest today says most of what you know about Latino voters and how to win them over is wrong. Mike Madrid is a third-generation Mexican-American and one of the country’s leading political strategists when it comes to Latino voters. He was a senior operative for the California Republican Party who rubbed shoulders with the likes of George W. Bush and his generation of GOP officials. Madrid later got jaded by Trump and co-founded the Lincoln Project. In his new book, “The Latino Century”, Madrid lays out a breadcrumb trail for both Republicans and Democrats to win this decisive block of voters, who he believes are very much up for grabs this year. He shares his findings with host & Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza as well as the reason why both parties are doing something right to win them — and something wrong. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO. Mike Madrid is a Latino GOP political consultant and author of "The Latino Century." Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On Wednesday morning, Frank Fahrenkopf received a letter from the Biden presidential campaign that ruined his day. Fahrenkopf is co-chair of the Commission on Presidential Debates, which has produced 33 debates since 1988, the first election year it was in business. He was planning on four more this year: three with Biden and Trump as well as the quadrennial vice presidential debate. But the Biden campaign told Fahrenkopf that the president would not be participating in any of them. Instead, the Biden campaign announced that it would negotiate with the Trump campaign and individual media organizations to plan two debates outside of the Commission’s process. By the end of the day Biden and Trump were set to debate in June on CNN and in September on ABC. On this episode of Deep Dive, Fahrenkopf joins host and Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza to discuss the fall-out from this decision, including the roles of Biden, Trump, and Anita Dunn; why he thinks RFK Jr. may have grounds for a lawsuit against CNN and what some of his favorite behind-the-scenes stories are from his decades of producing debates. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Frank Fahrenkopf is the co-chair of the Commission on Presidential Debates. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Fresh off fending off a hard-right coup attempt, the House speaker opens up about his strategy and his future plans for the GOP Conference. Topics in this lengthy interview include: Johnson’s victory over the GOP radicals; Israel; Ukraine; January 6th; the Trump trials; abortion; and his relationships with key Washington leaders, such as Joe Biden, Hakeem Jeffries, Kevin McCarthy and, of course, Donald Trump. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Rachael Bade is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Mike Johnson is the Speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Rep. Jerry Nadler, who has represented a big piece of Manhattan since 1992, is one of the longest-serving Jewish members of the House. He’s also a Columbia University alumnus: he was on campus in 1968 when police cleared Hamilton Hall of anti-Vietnam war protesters. Nadler is a close observer of the Middle East and the politics of Israel in the U.S. And he’s the ranking Democrat on the House Judiciary Committee, where he’s long seen himself as a champion of civil liberties. All of this background helped put Nadler at the center of a swirl of events this week as pro-Palestinian protesters at Columbia were ejected from Hamilton Hall, as President Biden made his first public remarks about campus protests, as a ceasefire deal between Hamas and Israel seemed tantalizingly close and as the House passed, by an overwhelming majority of 320 to 91, the Antisemitism Awareness Act — a bill against which Nadler led the opposition. On this week’s episode of Playbook Deep Dive, host and Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza talked talks with Nadler about all of this and about Trump’s interview in Time Magazine, the potential for disruption at the Democratic Convention in Chicago, the vote Nadler most regrets in his long career and the nature of truth. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Jerry Nadler is the ranking member of the House Judiciary Committee. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The biggest movie in the country right now is about a civil war — in America. If you see the film “Civil War” at a theater in downtown Washington, the scenes of the Lincoln Memorial exploding and the White House being attacked are jarring when you exit into the D.C. air. The movie is writer and director Alex Garland’s very in-your-face attempt to imagine the unimaginable in America — an authoritarian leader in the White House, intractable political differences being resolved through violence and the very specific horrors of modern warfare — urban fighting, refugee camps, mass atrocities, the collapse of the currency — all the things that we associate with stuff that can happen over there happening right here in the United States. “Civil War” is also a movie about journalism. It follows four reporters traveling from New York to Washington, D.C., via a circuitous route through Pennsylvania, West Virginia and Virginia. The movie takes on a lot of the weighty issues we talk about on shows like this one: media ethics, political polarization, disinformation polluting our media ecosystem and the potential threat from an autocratic leader. Wagner Moura plays a hardened war correspondent addicted to the battlefield. He also provides some much needed levity in the movie. Moura is best-known for his role as Pablo Escobar in “Narcos.” But he’s also a former journalist, a political activist and a writer and director himself. His 2019 movie “Marighella” about the coup and counter-revolution in Brazil in the 1960s incurred the wrath of then-president Jair Bolsonaro in Moura’s home country of Brazil. Deep Dive host and Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza talked with Moura on Thursday just as Washington’s annual White House Correspondents’ Association Dinner festivities were getting under way. It’s the time of year when the relationship between journalists, politicians and Hollywood is at its peak in this town. They had a fascinating conversation about how making a movie about a new civil war changed Moura’s own personal thinking about politics, how his experience with Bolsonaro in Brazil is a warning for Americans and the role of art in politics. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Wagner Moura is a star of A24's film "Civil War".Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

After months of delay, this week House Speaker Mike Johnson advanced his much awaited version of the Ukraine, Israel, and Taiwan foreign aid package. Standing between that legislation and the House floor: two very powerful committees. First, the House Appropriations Committee, which controls about a third of federal spending. And second, the Rules Committee, which controls access to the House floor, and which has become a problem for GOP leaders in this Congress. Johnson needed to pick the lock on both of these committees. And there is one Member of Congress who has chaired them both. Not just in the past year — but in the past month: Oklahoma Republican Tom Cole. Deep Dive host and Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza caught up with Cole on Thursday afternoon after he’d just testified in support of the foreign aid bill in front of his old committee. They got deep into the weeds of why the Rules Committee has been such a trouble spot for recent GOP speakers; and they discussed Johnson’s tenure so far and whether Cole thinks the Speaker can hang on as members threaten to oust him. Cole also previewed how he will run the Appropriations Committee, including how he’ll handle the controversial earmarks process. And Cole answered some prying questions from some of his favorite historians on the subject of Donald Trump. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Tom Cole is the chair of the House Appropriations committee. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Michael Cohen may be the only person standing between Donald Trump and jail. Three of Trump’s four criminal trials — the ones in Washington, Florida and Georgia — seem hopelessly stalled. But on this coming Monday in New York, the hush money case is set to begin. Deep Dive guest and former Trump lawyer Michael Cohen is the star witness in the case. On this episode, he joins host and Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza to discuss how he will defend the assault on his credibility at the trial, why Alvin Bragg’s case is stronger than analysts believe, the legal tactics he’s expecting from Trump’s team and whether he ever regrets breaking with Trump. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Michael Cohen is Donald Trump's former lawyer and fixer.Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On April 1, the Florida Supreme Court issued a pair of decisions on abortion that led the Biden campaign to declare that Florida, which Democrats have lost twice to Donald Trump, was now “winnable.” The only problem with that? Some of Florida’s abortion rights advocates want the president to stay away. At issue is Amendment 4, a measure on November’s ballot that would enshrine abortion in the state constitution — and will also need Republican and independent votes to pass. On this episode of Deep Dive, Anna Hochkammer, the executive director of the Florida Women’s Freedom Coalition and one of the architects of Florida’s abortion ballot initiative, joins host and Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza to discuss the delicate politics of building a bipartisan coalition around abortion rights in a red state like Florida. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Anna Hochkammer is the executive director of the Florida Women's Freedom Coalition. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A year ago today, Wall Street Journal reporter Evan Gershkovich was arrested in Russia and charged with espionage, an allegation he and the Journal said was absurd. The State Department declared that Gershkovich was “wrongfully detained,” an official status that commits the Biden administration to work for his release. Journal publisher Almar Latour has played a key role in the legal and diplomatic effort to free Gershkovich. On this episode of Playbook Deep Dive, host and Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza talks with Latour to learn the inside story of this effort. They discuss: how the shadow of basketball star Brittney Griner’s detainment in Russia is influencing talks to bring Evan home; why a Russian hitman serving a life sentence in Germany may be the key to unlocking a deal with Putin; and how the 2024 election may affect Gershkovich’s fate. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Almar Latour is CEO of Dow Jones and publisher of The Wall Street Journal.Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The politics of the Israel-Hamas war have become one of the most divisive issues in the Democratic Party. Mark Mellman, the president of Democratic Majority for Israel – and a longtime pollster – joins host and Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza to get into the weeds on the new politics of Israel within the Democratic Party. Other subjects covered include the polling data behind Biden’s age, Trump’s hold on the GOP, double doubters, abortion, the fate of Nikki Haley voters, and whether you should bother paying attention to polls in the first place. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Mark Mellman is the president of Democratic Majority for Israel.Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

TikTok, abortion, and IVF: three of the biggest issues in American politics right now and Kellyanne Conway is in the middle of all of them. Conway has been advising Donald Trump and Mike Pence for years and lately she’s best known for urging the GOP to leave TikTok alone and moderate the party’s message on reproductive rights. On this episode of Deep Dive, host and Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza has a spirited conversation with Conway at POLITICO’s Health Care Summit, where they recorded Deep Dive’s first-ever live show. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Kellyanne Conway is a GOP strategist and former Trump adviser. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

First ladies are among the most powerful advisers in any White House and Jill Biden is no exception. On this episode of Deep Dive, host and Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza is joined by NYT White House correspondent Katie Rogers, who recently published “American Woman: The Transformation of the Modern First Lady, from Hillary Clinton to Jill Biden,” an authoritative account of how this century’s first ladies have influenced the nation. Ryan and Katie discuss Jill Biden and Melania Trump’s roles in staffing, campaigning, and policy decisions; sensitive items from their times in the White House, such as Melania and Donald’s prenup; and whether or not Jill Biden has ever forgiven Kamala Harris for what she said about Joe in 2020. Additionally, Katie opened up about the time her editors at the New York Times sent her to Arkansas and forced her to report a story about the Bidens that she didn’t want to cover — and how it ended up forcing Jill and Joe to confront an uncomfortable truth about their family. Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.Katie Rogers is a White House correspondent for The New York Times. Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices